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Is Hip-Hop a Joke?


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#1 James Frank.

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Posted 22 October 2014 - 05:42 PM

Hey.

So today I was setting up some sound for this "Empathy Week" thing they're doing on campus that basically informs us all about sex trafficking and how it's a really bad thing...that's besides the point.

Anyway, I was setting up sound specifically for this acoustic guitarist who played some stuff as people came in and sat down. I tried steering the quick conversation we had to his music, and asked him if he records any of his stuff. I then tried hinting that I do music myself in my spare time, and I've always wamted to meld electronic and acoustic instrumentation together. He didn't seem to care as I was saying this, but I sorta described my sound as "experimental hip-hop". IMMEDIATELY his eyes glazed over and he basically just lost any interest he had whatsoever, and said something passive-aggressively polite like "well, that's what sells these days."

So that was that; I didn't even bother asking him if he would maybe be interested in collaborating, because I could see the answer on his face already. Instead, my question now is this: what the fuck is so wrong with hip-hop? Do any of you other producers out there feel this heavy stigma coming from musicians in other genreswhy is that, shouldn't we be past that shit by now? It's 2014, we're not in the fucking MC Hammer days anymore. In my eyes, hip-hop has evolved tremendously over the past ten, twenty years, and has more than proven itself worthy of academic praise (ahem, Aesop Rock)...so why the fuck is hip-hop still so far from being respected academically? It really pisses me off when I have to excuse my genre and vainly try to convince people that "no, I'm doing this SMART rap, not that DUMB bassy rap you hear everywhere else."

So, thoughts? Any of you guys find youself dealing with this c

#2 GOONIE

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Posted 24 October 2014 - 05:25 PM

James Frank, just out of curiosity, who is this "artist"?



#3 MWBOOGIE

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 10:59 AM

Do I think hip-hop is a joke? No I am a surly golden generation guy who enjoy
Ed passing around underground knowledge. Is it currently
A joke? Pretty much-people are trying to get paid off of bshit.

One thing I believe-hip hop producers have great ears for music.

I respect everyone on this site as mostly there are a lot of diggers on the site who enjoy The more mathematically complex genres and attendant histories.
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#4 James Frank.

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 11:57 AM

i could've sworn this topic had more responses in it than this...but oh well.

i just have this funny little dream of reaching out and collaborating with other musicians -- i feel like that's mutually beneficial to all parties involved.

 

he/she gets exposure; i get a chance to work on creating original compositions/lyrics; we all get paid eventually (maybe)...so what's the deal?

 

i'm just so sick of these fucking music snobs acting like hip-hop's still just a passing fad.

especially when rock AND jazz used to be marginalized in society at certain points in history.

 

for them to just dismiss all music that's made with computers is very narrow-minded...and hypocritical, if you include acts like Radiohead in the discussion.  it's like they have no issue with Danger Mouse producing a Black Keys track and mixing it with digital means, but God forbid if he decides to go back to his original persona and start sampling Beatles tracks again...it's just utter nonsense.



#5 MWBOOGIE

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 12:20 PM

Yeah there should be way more responses. It was a good post that touched on a real issue.

Your idea of collaborating is a great one-but bear in mind that you are brighter and more ethically centered than 99.999% of the individuals that You will be dealing with. There will be people that will have your back, but as you know many of these musicians are only out for their personal gain and rarely do they have funds. I won't begin to tell you about my forays into management and losses I have chalked up owing to my bleeding heart idealism.

You can definitely be a successful producer because you possess these qualities. But it's such an artificial playing field. I had the hardest time dumping some crooner who wanted me to invest myself in him. He kept saying that I had to pay for a good seat at the Grammys and the such. Or some low grade stickup kid with ties to Def Jam who liked to talk about how he had white people as slaves. You have to tread lightly and remember why you are doing this thing in the first place.

There is room to work with the likes of Sting and the police( or whatever the non illuminati moniker is). That was good stuff. Or the next Vivian Mojiica...but then you have to be the rap promoter...shit. You always have to be the promoter.

Don't deal with hipsters. You never hear the successful legends in soul music call out anybody for "not being real musicians."
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#6 James Frank.

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 01:35 PM

very true.  it's a weird stigma that i think will lessen over time -- i mean, look at jazz.  could you imagine the look on the faces of the aristocracy back then if they had been told that it would eventually become the go-to music for fancy occasions?  i imagine a day where large groups of refined gentlemen and women sit beside a fire sipping space wine and eating...fucking hologram crackers or something, playing Nicki Minaj on the loudspeaker as they discuss politics and bitcoins.

 


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#7 MWBOOGIE

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 01:59 PM

Jazz is the shit-all of it. It's like the lifeblood-like African drums. Funny that you mention internet currency. Ugh. I find it to be a near perfect metaphor for this post (almost) apocalyptic age. Baseless stuff, devoid of substance and govt backing. Shallow like any dude who drives a range rover. That's not what life is about. I'm glad that you brought it up. But I do see people that I run into who treat the sub genre of pop, as though it is a formula to rise up. It's their choice-but, there is something to adhering to pro-black/or what have you teaching.

I recognize how shallow I can be when I lust after Darling Nikki. She went thick long ago-but she may never get back to a reasonable weight. I love thick girls but you'll never hear me say that I want to hit up Aretha Franklin.

So, you are yourself stuck as an observer in a world you don't understand. Reminds me of the Chris Rock diatribe in his "bring the pain" special where he talks about hiding his intellectual inclinations from the brothas that are busy counting crack rocks.

#8 James Frank.

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 02:14 PM

^ this right here is the most quotable man on the STMB.



#9 MWBOOGIE

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 02:18 PM

I'd argue the same about You. It's nice to engage in postmodern dialogue in the Us. The future foretells that You will make a bigger mark.
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#10 EdTheYounger

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 02:41 PM

i could've sworn this topic had more responses in it than this...but oh well.


Think you may have accidentally posted twice or the forum had a hiccup... http://www.stonesthr...showtopic=26390

#11 GC90

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 03:09 PM

Yeah man, it's same deal with a bunch of shit like the Beatles, Elvis, etc. All the old people back then thought it was junk, now all the old people today love that crap but hate new pop. I'm sure it will be the same with all the shit like Justin Bieber, Nicki, Lil Wayne, Miley Cyrus, whatever shit is on the radio these days. IMO it all sucks and pop will continue to suck forever as it always has.



#12 James Frank.

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Posted 23 December 2014 - 03:43 PM

Yeah man, it's same deal with a bunch of shit like the Beatles, Elvis, etc. All the old people back then thought it was junk, now all the old people today love that crap but hate new pop. I'm sure it will be the same with all the shit like Justin Bieber, Nicki, Lil Wayne, Miley Cyrus, whatever shit is on the radio these days. IMO it all sucks and pop will continue to suck forever as it always has.

 

it's funny though, because there really does seem to be a progression of pop music getting worse and worse.  take that Nicki Minaj song above for example...like, compared to the Mama's and the Papa's singing about doves, it's kinda jarring to hear her rap about getting her ass eaten hahahaha.  i understand that our culture's loosening up as the years go by, but jesus christ...where's music gonna go from here?

 

what's gonna piss us off when we're all grumpy old men?  i found this one animation on YouTube that brilliantly speculates the future:

 


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#13 Jubito

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Posted 24 December 2014 - 03:35 AM

tl;dr whole topic...

My opinion is that most people who are production-deep in hip-hop, who respect the culture and understand its origins also have a deeper understanding and respect for all of the cultures who paved the way for hip-hop, and are not confined to the single genre of hip-hop. Pay respect where respect is due.

Yeah that guy can play the guitar, cool...You should have told him how Madlib, after years of beatmaking, single-handedly picked up multiple instruments and started releasing jazz albums. I bet that's more impressive than anything that guy knows about music.

People tend to be biased toward hip-hop heads and think of them as people who don't have any other musical tastes, how they 'steal' from other artists and can't play a single instrument, while it's the exact opposite (well at least for the small amount of people present on this board). And then shit gets tougher because these elitist bullshit hipsters think that hip-hop is the shit they play on the radio (OH THE MOTHER-FUCKING IRONY!!!!!!).

Bitch it's bigger than hip-hop....I bet that none of those suckers could even tell the drums on a J Dilla beat were made on a fucking MPC-3000, that's how deep he was into music. Those who love and respect the music and are inspired by it and express their love through creating more music THROUGH THEIR OWN STYLE are real artists. He could play all the guitars in the motherfucking world simultaneously, but I am sure that at the end of the day, the people of this forum share more love and respect for the music that paved the way than that guy.

Anyone who listens to hip-hop for the love of it and from a producers point of view should be able to feel what I'm trying to say.

I myself practiced playing the clarinet (cca. 3-4 years), piano (5 years) and guitar (cca. 4-5 years).

God I can't stand such stuck-up people.


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#14 Unknown Productions

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Posted Yesterday, 01:50 AM

People hate on rap music all the time saying its not real music

 

They say making beats is easy and sampling isn't making music

 

Its annoying that they can be so ignorant tho






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