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Respect for Ghostwritten/Written Artists?


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#1 RADIcule

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 12:42 PM

I'm assuming I'm in the right place to post this. I wanted to just get everyone's opinion on this subject because I don't think it goes addressed as often as it should: How are your feelings on artists whom receive aid from writers/ghostwriters? Do you have respect for them? I felt it was an interesting topic to touch on and see what people feel on the matter. So please, if you're reading, fire off a quick little response. I'd love to hear it. :D



#2 mangoes cash

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 01:17 PM

I love good song writing. I could care less John Lennon sung a song written by Paul McCartney. I wish there was more creative writing in hip hop for the sake of the music and less the ego. Yo. Yo yo yo. Yo.
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#3 fungus

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 03:27 PM

I love it when someone goes on a tirade about losing disrespect for rappers who don't write their own raps.  I love it because it's so naive and simplistic, and yet the people making that argument are so very angry about it.

 

Just to be clear:  I think it's fine.  There's many ways to earn respect as an artist, and there's a lot at play in this music – the delivery, the beat, the lyrics, the performance, the swagger, etc. 

 

Snoop is a great rapper and an icon, but not a great lyricist.  He's great on "Still D.R.E." with lyrics written by Jay-Z.  Biz Markie is another rap icon who is no less an icon because Big Daddy Kane wrote many of his lyrics.  

 

No one seems to whine about Sinatra not writing his shit or Robert DeNiro not writing the lines he's famous for delivering. 


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#4 JoaGymshoe

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 04:17 PM

...do ghosts write with invisible ink? ;) ...

 

...fo seriouz.. I think the intention of rap should be to speak ones mind... not someone elses...

 

...If you ain't good enough at it... too bad... I can't run like Usain Bolt...

 

...If it's for entertainment/music business purposes well...  money seems to be the main motivator...

 

...I don't judge... but even rappers who write their own lyrics can "cheat" ... like for instance in the genre gangster rap...

 

...I'm all for creative license though... I sometimes embellish, exgerate and add some extra color to the lyrics I write too

 

...while living  the part I play... playing the part I live...


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#5 EdTheYounger

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 05:02 PM

Just because Quentin Tarantino can write doesn't mean dude should act...

In my opinion if something sounds dope.... It's dope. It's our responsibility as enthusiasts to dig deeper and give respect to the people who worked on the project and who deserve it. I think hip hop as a whole needs more collaboration and sharing and not just feature artists or rappers on other producers beats. The roots are a perfect example of what can come creatively when more than just a handful of artists work on all aspects of a full project together... I'm sure they've helped each other out with verses along the way too.
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#6 SunnyMeadowz

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 06:20 AM

What fungus said.


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#7 James Frank.

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 12:20 PM

i'm officially open for business, people...

 

you need a verse, i got a verse.  in fact, i got so many verses in my back-lot's inventory that i'm practically giving them away!

we're having a HUGE liquidation sale here at Crazy J's used verse lot, buy 1 get 1 free!  everything must go, act now before it's too late -- and don't forget to tell 'em Crazy J sent ya!!!


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#8 RADIcule

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 02:08 PM

This is pretty interesting. I expected to see a good variety of response. I totally can vibe with the points given: It seems that there can be a bit of bias based upon genres, I feel. in regards to what fungus was getting at, you really don't hear that sort of criticism come into play when it's artists of Sinatra's acclaim or when it comes to the acting craft. It makes me think of another question, which I'm sure has been addressed, but that'll be for another time. However, I can side with Joa too. There's a part of me that stays a bit adamant about just going along with the reality that there are some artists have writers. I think for some it can bring in a question of creativity: "Is that performer truly as prolific as they lead on?" I'm just trying to play Devil's Advocate here. I totally agree on the front of proposing more collaborations in hip-hop, but I feel there comes a question of just how many rappers and producers can put their ego aside to truly work on something beautiful. I think that's where a line can be drawn between artist and profiteers. 

 

And James, once you said liquidation, I died! lmao. shit had me rolling. 



#9 OfficeTime8889

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Posted Today, 02:47 PM

I'm assuming I'm in the right place to post this. I wanted to just get everyone's opinion on this subject because I don't think it goes addressed as often as it should: How are your feelings on artists whom receive aid from writers/ghostwriters? Do you have respect for them? I felt it was an interesting topic to touch on and see what people feel on the matter. So please, if you're reading, fire off a quick little response. I'd love to hear it. :D

 

More often than not there are multiple authors on a song -- it's industry custom.  Sometimes only one is credited, but that doesn't mean much in this topsy-turvy business.  To the question of how I feel about ghostwriters: I think it's fascinating.  I think some of our favorite songs were ghostwritten but we'll never know nor do we really want to know.  Think about how much it would hurt to know your favorite artist, Nas, Jay-Z, Tupac, Biggie, Eminem, Mos Def, DOOM, Black Thought, Jay Electronica, and/ or others had their music (whole or partially) written for them.  That could be devastating.  

 

"The secret to creativity is hiding your sources." ~ Canibus

 

I think the better question(s) in this matter is why do we care so much?  Should we care as much as we do?  Probably not.  Mainstream and even underground music is no different than professional wrestling really.  Most people only care about the spectacle that is music/ wrestling and not so much about the behind-the-scenes stuff.  Most of what we come into contact with is a product of marketing dollars.  



#10 The Jackal

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Posted Today, 03:18 PM

I don't understand respect for ghostwritten artists. If it's in a band, thats one thing. I don't care if the bassist wrote the hit that the lead singer is singing. That's a band, they make music together. 

Acting is a totally different category altogether. An actor assumes a role. The craft is in making the character come alive, not in writing the character. It's about embodying the words and making it your own. 

As far as Sinatra not writing his own shit, whatever. The dude is a good soundtrack for olive garden, but is he really considered to be a brilliant artist or just a great entertainer? 

That's where the difference is to me. If you're an MC, you're writing/spitting from the heart and soul. How am I supposed to "feel" it if you're actually just pretending to rap about some shit that happened to you. 

As for ghostwriting punchlines, why have punchlines at all if you can't do it yourself? 

It's not like rappers have this big job to do, and they should need assistance. It's simple. Write lyrics and practice your technique. I love Dr. Dre's beats but never really cared for his albums for this reason. I always find his verses to be silly. They sound phony, and I felt that way before I knew they were being ghostwritten. But then again, a lot of gangster rap sounds phony to me. I typically hate rappers that rap about guns, drugs, and gangster shit unless it's over the top/horrorcore like Big L or Kool Keith. 



#11 James Frank.

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Posted Today, 03:45 PM

^ i sorta agree with the Jackal, but i also welcome it as an MC who actually does write his own shit...us low-key dudes gotta make our money somehow, and if someone were to approach me with compensation asking me to write 16 bars for them, i would totally oblige -- just sayin'...






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