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"Negative" Rap Has Negative Effect On Society?


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#1 taza_one

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 12:35 AM

The burden is on you.


I don't get it so do me a favor, "enlighten" me.

Real heads wanna know the deal.

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#2 taza_one

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 09:08 AM

"It seems like it does" is hardly proof.

if you don't think negativity has an effect on society you probably don't think positivity does either. in this case, rap & all other forms of art are basically meaningless to society.


Rather than guessing what I think, how about spelling out your point because some angry germain guy on youtube and this is hardly proof. <_<

#3 shroombudagwa

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 09:21 AM

dude,
just look at "thuugs" and "ganstas", do you feel comfortable around these people?
Do you feel they are outstanding citizens? ones who you should look up to?
or do you feel that they are not role models? ones that should not guide societies values?

#4 taza_one

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 09:23 AM

Thugs and gangsters existed before rap. Just because some may like rap doesn't mean rap created them. It doesn't make sense. By this logic, opera created italian gangsters. <_<

#5 shroombudagwa

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 09:31 AM

dude,
you didnt listen to my point earlier.
Im saying you are right, except that now, thugs and gangstas are all over TV, magazines.. they are a major player in popular culture, so as a result, kids who would never ever consider being a thug or gangsta now try to emulate that.

Thats what I think is negative and thats what I think in a large part helps to contribute to why so many kids these days want to act so tuff and so cool, and really it just bothers me.

#6 Drums

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 10:13 AM

i think gangster rap attracts young people just like violent movies or computer games. the dangerous lifestyle and attitude is of course appealing to a lot of younger folks. i don't know if does have a negative effect though. i think most people grow out of it. this type of music is not for grown people. even if i sometimes catch myself vibing out to some gangsta rap in the club i never take it seriously.

#7 Drums

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 10:18 AM

and...

i think that the effect is different over the world. i don't know how it is in the states, but over here (sweden) there's hardly anybody adapting this lifestyle on their own. they maybe go around dressing like big babies, but they don't go out and a buy a gun just cause fifty has a gun.

#8 BazacoPROject

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 10:26 AM

"It seems like it does" is hardly proof.
Rather than guessing what I think, how about spelling out your point because some angry germain guy on youtube and this is hardly proof. <_<


Dude, I think he has a point. I mean, I want to believe that no one is stupid enough to let gangster rap/bullet slang influence them into a life of crime, but when dude said, if you think that music can have a positive effect on somthing, then the negative (by default) should be possible too, I had to agree.

I think that he has a point.

Truthfully, I feel that all things have the potential to effect people (video games, music, movies all that shit). It has the potential to effect/influence those individuals who have not had the foundation of knowledge developed by their parents/guardians/environment/etc. that allows them to seperate image and entertainment from reality and good example.

I personally, feel that anyone who was born and raised in the ghetto their whole life, in a broken home and a guardian who dosen't or can't raise them effectively, will be forced to look at outside example to learn from. These outside examples will come from people who they see as a success in their environment (store owners, teachers, athletes and YES drug dealers YES "thug" artists they see on TV who come from the same hood they do). Now, all though they will get that positive influence (mentioned above, i.e. teachers, etc.), there will most likely be an overwhelming influence coming from all the fucking TV kids watch. As a kid, I watched a shit load of MTV and BET for the music and young cool stuff I thought they showed (because I was a stupid kid). So, if this hypothetical individual does as I did and watches a shit load of MTV and BET, they will undoubtedly see a shit load of Bullet slang/ bragadoccio thugery/trap music videos which they will further associate with their situation and their invironment and maybe their future career path.

Now, does that burden fall on the people creating the music? Not technically. Technically, the burden falls on who ever birthed that kid. If you are going to sleep around and have sex, you should be prepared to do your part when and if you have a kid. Because if you have a child and that child lives in the ghetto and you DON'T do your part, then what I just mentioned above will be a huge possibility for that child.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, YES, "negative" rap can have a negative effect on society WHEN parents don't do their part in raising their child.

#9 shroombudagwa

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 10:57 AM

here her, I agree,
maybe you guys are right tho too, maybe this musc is for youth and maybe it wont have a moajor affect on them but i cant help but think it does have a major affect on they carry thmeselves at minimum and just hate seeing all these thugged out wanna be gangstas, andeven worse, the little wanna be ghetto bitches who think that they are so cool cause theyve fucked 30 guys by the age of 10.

maybe an exaggeration but still.

#10 taza_one

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 01:02 PM

Based on the logic I'm reading, y'all would agree that playing an Ozzy record backwards causes suicide. The crime rate has gone down over the last five years and gangster rap has become more prevalent, so based on your logic, gangster rap causes less crime.

Study this concept.

correlation does not imply causation.

#11 G-ONG

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 01:31 PM

You need to look at it the other way round....

negative society = negative rap.

#12 BazacoPROject

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 02:06 PM

Based on the logic I'm reading, y'all would agree that playing an Ozzy record backwards causes suicide. The crime rate has gone down over the last five years and gangster rap has become more prevalent, so based on your logic, gangster rap causes less crime.

Study this concept.

correlation does not imply causation.


Not sure if I'm being lumped into the statement "based on the logic I'm reading" statement. But, if I am a part of that satement, then NO I disagree with that.

NO I don't agree that listening to Ozzie records backwards causes suicide at all. I don't know anything about it.

NO I don't agree that gangster rap causes less crime.

I'm simply stating that ingorant minds can be influenced by stupid things such as movies, music and video games. However, it is not the fault of movies, music and video games that ignorant minds can be influenced by them.

I don't think that music CAUSES anything. Music is just there, people CAUSE things to happen. If an Ozzy record were to cause suicide, then wouldn't it be killing itself? Same with Gangster rap, gangster rap dosen't cause crime rates to move at all.

Do you mean that Ozzy records cause PEOPLE to commit suicide? And that gangster raps cause people to commit less crime? I still disagree, I'm just trying to understand what the heck led you to that conclusion and what statement you got that vibe from.





You need to look at it the other way round....

negative society = negative rap.


I can agree with that, however, I think it's a vicious cycle. Like this:

negative society = negative rap = negative society =......

#13 shroombudagwa

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 02:28 PM

yah and I;ll ad on to that saying that because of tv and interent the negative society=negative rap now doenst just go back into itself but insteads spreads around the world.

#14 DJ Projexion

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 03:43 PM

You guys need to stop having such a "negative" outlook on things. I like to think that it's only a small few that will be influenced in a negative way, but rather the majority will take it for what it is and not be affected by it at all. Society will never be perfect, even if you eliminate all the negative elements that are out there.

Just watch Gangs of New York, took place only 100 years ago and yet no negative music or movies etc. existed at the time. But we were far more violent and criminal in nature, you have to admit we've come a long way since then.

#15 ren

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 04:10 PM

yah, maybe Im just blowing it all out of proportion but bottom line still is that I just dont like it.
Shrrom, (changing my name, shroom doent really fit me anymore as I havent done shrooms well since the summer .. but you get the pic.
easy)

#16 taza_one

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 04:58 PM

yah, maybe Im just blowing it all out of proportion but bottom line still is that I just dont like it.
Shrrom, (changing my name, shroom doent really fit me anymore as I havent done shrooms well since the summer .. but you get the pic.
easy)


You are 100% entitled to that opinion and I respect it. That's not what I was talking about. Let me be a little more specific. I'm hearing reasons why things are bad or good, based on assumption. I.E., If positive music has a positive effect then by default, negative music should have a negative effect. You have defined what "negative" is (drug, violent, materialistic, sexist content) and the "effect" on youth has been characterized as ????? I'm going to say, wannane or real gang membership, early promiscuity, and other values based on the musica content. Then what is positive music and effect? It doesn't natter because it's all hypoyhetical, based on assumption, stereotype, and guesswork.

What if playing a violent video game distracted a potential killer and the person played the game, rather than killing for real. Whouldn't that be a "positive" "effect"? That's just an example of how this logic seems flawed.



PEACE

#17 neologism

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 05:29 PM

negative music, movies and videogames are always the scapegoat.

i think any kind of music can make someone violent...if someone hates kenny g, then they might get real angry and tempremental after having to hear his music...some real deep psychology stuff im sure.

#18 zomg

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Posted 11 December 2006 - 10:15 PM

If you really wanna know...talk to the kids. But they won't admit it - they're too busy being brainwashed to figure it out on their own.

I think imagery is worse than the music. Most kids dont know shit about what's being said...but if someone young has somebody slightly older than them around, translating (even if not directly to them) what it means and displaying that it's possibly 'the norm' ...then they absorb.

If they got somebody around boasting the idea that it's really 'cool', (i.e a 12 year old and their 18 year old older sibling)..then that's when it will have the effect on them (as a young person)

I think that the 'negative' music is sort of like the icing on the rotten piece of turd being served to the youth through the media.

This sort of thing rings true to me...but people get turned off when other people take this same shit and put it in some weird context and point fingers and stuff...but don't fool yourselves..it's true.

#19 ren

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 09:20 AM

best thought ever

#20 taza_one

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 09:51 AM

Bad kids will be bad, regardless of the music. Good kids will be good, even if they don't have a good homelife. I've seen it played out many times.

I have read so many comments about the "ghetto" and it's youth that are so prejudice that it makes me think many of you have never been to the ghetto.

Children are smarter than you think.

If you really wanna know...talk to the kids. But they won't admit it - they're too busy being brainwashed to figure it out on their own.


I call bullshit. That's a real ignorant comment. I worked with kids, not suburban kids, and when we deconstructed lyrics, they realized they were negative. You guys act like ghetto youth have no brains and it's offensive to me.

#21 G-ONG

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 11:05 AM

most people havnt been to the ghetto

most people dont even understand the term ghetto.

Ghetto used to mean stuff like the places were Jews were locked up in Nazi Germany, and other places like that.


And yeah, children are definitely smarter then what is percieved. The problem with this negative rap negative society has little to do with children themselves, but more on adults and the surrounding environment that control a childs society.

#22 BazacoPROject

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 12:17 PM

Bad kids will be bad, regardless of the music. Good kids will be good, even if they don't have a good homelife. I've seen it played out many times.

I have read so many comments about the "ghetto" and it's youth that are so prejudice that it makes me think many of you have never been to the ghetto.

Children are smarter than you think.
I call bullshit. That's a real ignorant comment. I worked with kids, not suburban kids, and when we deconstructed lyrics, they realized they were negative. You guys act like ghetto youth have no brains and it's offensive to me.


Nah, Ghetto kids on average are smarter than the suburbanites out there, because they have to be. You should check out "guns germs and steel", it really tackles the idea that environments where survival is more of a challenge, breeds individuals who have to be smart as a whip and quick on their feet, intellectually.

It's unfortunate that many of those individuals never get the opportunity to use those brains in the academic environment, partly because of the negative influence we have been discussing.

#23 DJ Projexion

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 01:16 PM

Like I said before, the only conclusion we've come to at this point is that the issue is somewhat of a grey area with no definitive cause and effect.

#24 taza_one

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Posted 12 December 2006 - 01:20 PM

Like I said before, the only conclusion we've come to at this point is that the issue is somewhat of a grey area with no definitive cause and effect.






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